I recently received an email from a co-worker titled “Can Muslim be good American’s” It ended with stating that Barack Obama is a Muslim, which I know NOT to be true so I started to check out some of the other statements. The more I read them I began to realize very similar arguments could be made about a Christian Fundamentalist. It is not like all Christians interpret the Bible in the same manner nor do all Christians take every word and sentence in the Bible literally, as this email insinuates all Muslims do with the Quran.
Not that I want to be or that I don’t want to be a defender of the Muslim faith or Barack Obama, but I do want to be a defender of truth and not promote inaccurate and confusing messages in this already complex political world. In attempt to achieve that end, please read below as I utilize someone else’s detailed critique of the email, point by point.
Here is the link to the original analysis of a similar email:
http://www.deanesmay.com/posts/1146977644.shtml
I don’t particularly like the above person’s sarcastic tone but he does layout and interesting argument. It also appears he was responding to a different and slightly harsher version of the email?
Here is some of the text below but a bit toned down to focus on the content and not the name calling (go to the link above to see the full argument):
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The original email text will be in Italic and in “quotes”.
The response will be in BOLD ——————————————————————————————————–
“CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS?
This is very interesting! We all need to read it from start to finish……… and send it on to anyone who will read it. Maybe this is why our American Muslims are so quiet and not speaking out about any atrocities.
Can a good Muslim be a good American?
This question was forwarded to a friend who worked in Saudi Arabia for 20 years.
The following is his reply:
Theologically – no. . . . Because his allegiance is to Allah, The moon God of Arabia.”
The word “Allah” means “God.” In Arab-speaking lands, Jews and Christians and Muslims all refer to God as “Allah.” Because that’s what the word means: God.
Muslims believe they worship the same exact God as the Jewish and Christian God. They worship the God of Abraham. They consider the Bible flawed but still a holy book.
“Religiously – no. . . . Because no other religion is accepted by His Allah except Islam (Quran, 2:256) (Koran).”
A translation says this:
[2.256] There is no compulsion in religion; truly the right way has become clearly distinct from error; therefore, whoever disbelieves in the Shaitan and believes in Allah he indeed has laid hold on the firmest handle, which shall not break off, and Allah is Hearing, Knowing.
All this appears to say is that religion is voluntary, not compulsory (the Koran says that in more than one place) but if you believe in God and reject Satan then God will know and you’ll be in good shape.
“Scripturally – no. . . . Because his allegiance is to the five Pillars of Islam and the Quran.”
First off, not all Muslims follow the “five pillars.” Most Sunni do, most Shia do not. But either way, there’s nothing particularly sinister about those pillars, which are:
1) Profess to believe that there is no God except for God, and that Muhammed was his messenger.
2) Pray to God at least five times a day, if it’s practical and you can manage it.
3) Give alms (“zakat”) to the poor. This is usually money, but can be food if you can’t give money.
4) Fast from dawn to dusk for one month a year, known as Ramadan. This is only for adults, and not for people who are sick or elderly.
5) If practical, and you can afford it, make at least one pilgrimmage in your life to visit Mecca.
Those who believe in these five pillars say that if you meet them that makes you a Muslim regardless of just about anything else.
“Geographically – no. . . . Because his allegiance is to Mecca , to which he turns in prayer five times a day.”
This is like saying Jews can’t be good Americans because their allegiance is to Israel, or Catholics can’t be good Americans because their allegiance is to the Vatican in Rome.
“Socially – no. . . . Because his allegiance to Islam forbids him to make friends with Christians or Jews.”
The Koran in parts says don’t be friends with treacherous unbelievers, but then in other parts says God may give you friends among the unbelievers. Most Muslims I know interpret that to mean you shouldn’t be friends with treacherous or deceitful unbelievers, but if unbelievers treat you honorably then you can be friends with them.
Furthermore, the word “infidel” is a Christian term. It was invented centuries ago by Christians to describe Muslims, Jews, idol-worshippers, and other non-Christians. Indeed, here’s a lengthy quote from the King James Bible:
4 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?
15 And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel? (emphasis mine.)
16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.
17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you.
That would be 2 Corinthians:14-17. (See also 1 Timothy 5:8 in the King James).
Doesn’t that say that Christians shouldn’t be friends with unbelievers? Yes, if you take it literally that’s exactly what it says. Indeed, it says people who aren’t Christians are unclean and shouldn’t even be touched, if you read it too literally.
The thing is, very few Christians believe such a thing. Because those verses need to be read in their proper historical context, and in the context of the rest of the Bible. Which is exactly how you have to take anything that’s in the Koran: in proper historical context, and in the context of the full book and not just one or two verses.
“Politically – no. . . . Because he must submit to the mullahs (spiritual leaders), who teach annihilation of Israel and destruction of America, the great Satan.”
“Mullah” is not even found in the Koran, and most Muslims don’t use that word. But it’s not a bad word: it’s a Persian term, used mostly in Iran, and it means “religious scholar” or “teacher.” In other words, it’s virtually identical to the word “rabbi,” which is a Hebrew and Aramaic word that basically means: mullah!
There is only one country in the world–Iran–where by law Muslims are forced to obey mullahs, because a vicious group of renegades, led by the Ayatollah Khomeini, seized power in 1979. That is the only country in the world like that.
There are over one Billion Muslims in the world. There are only about 68 million Muslims in Iran. And by all accounts, most people in Iran hate the mullah regime and wish it would go away.
“Domestically – no. . . . Because he is instructed to marry four women and beat and scourge his wife when she disobeys him (Quran 4:34).”
The fourth book of the Koran, known as “The Women,” says that a man may marry as many as four women, but only if he can do justice to all of them. And if he has any doubts about that, he should marry only one woman (Koran 4:3). Historically, this practice is usually only when a man is very rich, or, when a widow who has children at home needs a new husband and no single man is able or willing to marry her. In primitive, poverty-ridden societies, women and children with no man to provide for them are usually in serious trouble.
As for wife-beating: The Muslim site “Answering Christianity” has a very detailed rebuttal to Christians who claim the Koran endorses wife-beating, citing chapter and verse in the Koran and other Muslim sources. The short answer is that there is one controversial verse, which has multiple interpretations, which MIGHT make it okay to do this in extreme circumstances–MAYBE.
Compare to the bible: If you look through the Bible you’ll find that many biblical figures had multiple wives, including Abraham, Jacob (also known as Israel), Judah, David, and Solomon. You’ll also find parts of the Bible which say people should be stoned to death for blasphemy or adultery. Most Christians and Jews today don’t take such instructions literally, and neither do most Muslims today.
“Intellectually – no. . . . Because he cannot accept the American Constitution since it is based on Biblical principles, and he believes the Bible to be corrupt.”
The words “God” or “Bible” or “Christian” are nowhere in the entire text of the Constitution? Here’s a link to the Constitution to search through. And here’s a link to the Bill of Rights.
Our First Amendment reads:
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof……
“Philosophically – no. . . . Because Islam, Muhammad, and the Quran do not allow freedom of religion and expression.
Democracy and Islam cannot co-exist.”
This is interesting considering the citation above (see Quran, 2:256) of a verse from the Koran that clearly says there can be no compulsion in religion–which sounds like freedom of religion and thought?
“Every Muslim government is either dictatorial or autocratic.”
The Grand Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani has been one of the world’s foremost advocates of democracy, urging all Muslims to vote and be a part of the democratic process both in his homeland of Iraq (which is now a democracy) and around the world. He says voting and being part of democratic processes is a fundamental duty of all Muslims.
Democratic nations dominated by Muslims include Indonesia, Mali, Senegal, Turkey, Albania, Niger, and Nigeria–and nowadays, also Iraq, Afghanistan, and Lebanon.
The largest democracy in the world is India. Who’s India’s president? Avul Pakir Jainulabdeen Abdul Kalam–a Muslim.
“Spiritually – no. . . . Because when we declare “one nation under God,” the Christian’s God is loving and kind, while Allah is NEVER referred to as Heavenly father, nor is he ever called love in The Quran’s 99 excellent names.”
“And spend in the way of Allah and cast not yourselves to perdition with your own hands, and do good (to others); surely Allah loves the doers of good.” (Koran 2:195)
“Surely Allah loves those who turn much (to Him), and He loves those who purify themselves.” (Koran 2:222)
“Say: If you love Allah, then follow me, Allah will love you and forgive you your faults, and Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.” (3:31)
“Those who spend (benevolently) in ease as well as in straitness, and those who restrain (their) anger and pardon men; and Allah loves the doers of good (to others).” (3:134)
No, the Koran doesn’t refer to God as the “heavenly father.” But love, compassion, mercy, and benevolence are all ascribed to God over and over again. The 99 names of God mentioned in the Koran include “Peace and Blessing,” “The Subtly Kind,” “The All Forgiving,” “The Bountiful, the Generous,” and “The Loving, The Kind” (more here.)
“Therefore after much study and deliberation, perhaps we should be very suspicious of ALL MUSLIMS in this country.”
Or “suspicious” of the original author of this email, as all of the content can be debunked with a simple Google or Wikipedia search
“They obviously cannot be both “good” Muslims and good Americans.”
No reason to comment here as it has been laid out above
“* * * Call it what you wish; it’s still the truth.”
Interesting the author feels the need to say this is the “truth”
“* * * You had better believe it.”
Again, why have to reiterate this if what has been stated is the “truth”?
“* * * The more who understand this, the better it will be for our country and our future. The religious war is bigger than we know or understand.”
Or the more confused people will be? And what “religious war” are we in? I thought it was a war on terrorism, or Iraq, or Afghanistan? If the US was in a religious war which side would we be fighting for? I thought we came over on three ships to get away from religious oppression not start it? Maybe we would be of the side of “freedom of Religion”?
“And Barack Hussein Obama, a Muslim, wants to be our President?”
Barack Obama is not a Muslim and he will not be swore in on the Quran. This is easy to confuse with the fact that Congressman Keith Ellison of Minnesota’s 5th district swore in on the Quran
Other links:
http://www.snopes.com/politics/religion/ellison.asp
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/muslim.asp
“You HAVE to be kidding?! Wake up America!”
And Google all the “facts” or statements in this email
“Obama even says if he wins the election, he will be sworn in on the Quran (Koran)—not the Bible!”
Again, not true – see above
“PLEASE, please pass this to all in your address book.”
Along with the comments (in BOLD) to give people an alternative argument and let them come to their own conclusions
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Just my $.02,
Chip
THROWING STONES 
I think you did a very good job analyzing this. The bottom line is that people should be judged by what they say and do rather than by claims about how they would act based on the primary texts of their religions. Most people do not adhere to all the rules of their religion. For instance, while the Torah has 613 commandments that Jews are supposed to follow, most probably only know the more famous “10 Commandments”. It would be wrong to quote the other 603 commandments and claim that all American Jews obey them.
Excellent analysis. Thanks!
It amazes me how some Americans always seem to fall back on racism and finding a way to hate a group of people. I am pretty disappointed and disgusted regarding some of the things that I have heard from people in this country regarding Muslims. These hateful people are no better than the terrorists and others who hate Americans.
Hating a religion is not racism, if you want to know what can “potentially” happen in a country with too many Muslims pushing their own agenda, and medieval beliefs there are many European countries struggling with Islamic issues.
Not impressed with this as a Christian.
Why not impressed? Is it because it made sense on a point you didn’t wish to hear?
I know one thing… your not much of a Christian if you spread lies and cause hate for your fellow man.
Excellent analysising. I like the way you write and how you answer back. Lots of people can learn positive thing from it including myself.
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This is a completely EMPTY analysis.
Allah is a derivative of Ali the Moon Godess of Pagan Arabia. Mohammed just mixed up his pagan past with newly acquired information of Jews & Christian beliefs. The Jews & Christians don’t really believe that the God that they refer to in their faith is the same God. Jews believe in ONE God and the Christians believe in 3 in 1 God (a mixed up [much like Mohammed] version of Judism by the newly converted polythestic Greeks). The Greek weren’t comfortable with the Jewish rituals and Paul allowed them to depart from them.
The 2nd point is so absurd as to make me ALMOST speechless. 🙂 There is NO RELIGIOUS freedom to Muslims where it comes to their countries. In fact, people have been MURDERED who dare show a cross on their neck within a “devout” Muslim country. I can’t stand the dishonesty of you people.
Just like the Jewish Bible, the NT AND the Koran, they are riddled with errors and contradiction. So, you pull out a verse that contradicts all the other verses that say that the Muslim cannot befriend Christians & Jews. In fact, Mohammed’s dying words were “Drive the Jews from the Arabia.” or something near that. Mohammed HATED the Jews for rejecting that he was a prophet like their prophets of old. In fact, they laughted him out of a city that was the first city that Mohammed and his army of believers burned and killed.
Keep up the lies. Only the very naive will continue to believe you. ANYBODY that is slightly familiar with Jewish, Christian & Muslim history knows the bad that they have ALL, at some time in history, used their faith to do terrible things. The difference is that we’re in the middle of the Muslim’s “dark ages” RIGHT NOW!
Get a clue and make some steps toward honest if it is possible for you!
Also, I resent that I have to put my email on these comments. If I start received death threats by the peace loving Muslims, I’m going to sue.
Sandra, i just read your comment from 2008… you are part of the problem.. Your information is as wrong as you can get. Allah is the god of Abraham and Abraham is a Muslim Profit along with being a Christian Profit. So same Abraham, same Allah. Your church bullshit is dangerous and a fantasy. Until you accept the truth, and give space to others in the world, even your god will dam you to Hell. Jesus said be kind to others… Allah said, I love those who love others. More acts of Terrorism have been performed by Christians on US soil, than any other religion. Jim Jones, Tim McVei, The Uni- Bomber and the Anthrax Lady not to mention Boston. So why are you not condemning the Baptists…they are the proven terrorists.
/cheers Sandra
I hope everyone can see how “TRUTH” can be perception. Different truths are posted here. Sarah Palin touched on this during the VP debate when she mentioned the media filter. People you are not being told the truth, a large percentage of what you hear is filtered, altered, or distorted in some way. The news and media are there to sell themselves, not keep you truthfully informed.
Sarah Palin also told you that Obama would take all your savings and guns and turn the US into a Socialist Country while putting all the Conservatives from the centre states in concentration camps…. so, I think Palin is about as reliable as Harpo Marx.
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Can a devout Muslim be an American patriot and a loyal citizen? Consider this:
A: Theologically, no. Because his allegiance is to Allah, the moon god of Arabia.
Reality: In the Qur’an, we read that the earth in its entirety belongs to God, and humans can settle anywhere as long as they do not encroach on the rights of others to that piece of land where they will settle. As such, wherever Muslims live, they have the responsibility to defend the community and take care of the environment and other related matters for the good of all. “Patriotism”, in the sense of “love for a place where one lives and has a home and family” is part of one’s faith in Islam. Hence, “loyalty” and “patriotism” to one’s country of residence is an obligation that stems from one’s faith commitment. “Allegiance” to God means allegiance to the betterment of this earth and its inhabitants without the extremes of negative nationalism and patriotisms.
A: Scripturally, no. Because his allegiance is to the five pillars of Islam and the Quran (Koran). Geographically, no. Because his allegiance is to Mecca, to which he turns in prayer five times a day.
Reality: In Islam there is no concept of Promised Land to which one day all Muslims must return before the Final Days. There is no allegiance to any part of the earth, not even to Mecca. Allegiance is only to God, the Creator and Sustainer of the Universe. No Muslim has “allegiance” to the Five Pillars. The Five Pillars are nothing more than the means to show one’s obedience to God. Mecca is important simply because it has one of the holiest places of worship – mosques – built by Prophet Abraham and his son Ismael. No Muslim ever dreams of returning to Mecca for permanent residence. There is always a desire to visit and to worship God in the sanctuary.
A: Socially, no. Because his allegiance to Islam forbids him to make friends with Christians or Jews.
Reality: Again, there is no “allegiance” to Islam. There is faith in God and “Islam” is an act of submission to God’s will that requires Muslims to live in peace with all communities on earth, including the Jews and the Christians. However, if any group of humanity engages in hostility against Muslims then they are required to defend themselves. There is no blind friendship or loyalty in Islam. If friendship to any human being, regardless whether that person is a Muslim, Jew, or Christian leads to corruption in society, then Muslims are to shun such company and loyalty.
A: Politically, no. Because he must submit to the mullah (spiritual leaders), who teach annihilation of Israel and destruction of America, the great Satan.
Reality: In Islam there is neither “church” nor “priesthood.” No Muslim has an obligation to follow a scholar (Mullah) who teaches hatred and harm to others. To the contrary, it is the duty of Muslims to follow the leaders who represent the moral and spiritual values of Islam. No one can stand indifferent to injustice in the world and regard himself or herself as a member of the human community, let alone of the Muslim community. At the same time, Muslims must always be alert and prepared to face the hostility and irrational attitude of other peoples. It is Satanic to demonize other human beings – whether it is done religiously or politically; whether it comes in the form of religious bigotry, or social and political discrimination.
A: Domestically, no, because he is instructed to marry four women and beat and scourge his wife when she disobeys him (Quran 4:34).
Reality: There is no such blanket obligation in the Qur’an to marry four wives. The quoted verse occurs in the context of orphan girls under the custody of a guardian who, in the interest of preserving the property of the orphan girls, is instructed to marry one, two, three or four, provided he can treat them justly. Islam did not invent polygamy. It existed before it in every religion and civilization, and Islam is the first religion to actually limit the number of wives to four. The Qur’an also underscores the reality in spousal relationship that treating with justice among multiple wives is impossible, and, therefore, a Muslim is advised to stick to one wife. The question of honor of the home is extremely central to the Qur’an and therefore, whether it is a woman who is unfaithful to her husband or a husband who is unfaithful to his wife (Q. 4:128), the matter deserves to be resolved quickly to preserve the sanctity of the family.
A: Religiously, no. Because no other religion is accepted by his Allah except Islam (Quran, 2:256)
Reality: Quite to the contrary, of all the three Abrahamic scriptures, it is only in the Qur’an that Judaism, Christianity and Islam are treated as equally capable of guiding and saving their own flocks. God has no problem with any religion because there is only true faith that leads different peoples of the world to their Creator. It is a problem when different faith communities teach discrimination against others. In the record of the world history, one needs to examine whether it was Islam or any other religion that had problem with coexistence with other communities. The record of Islamic civilization is clear and open for anyone needing evidence of tolerance and acceptance of other faiths and peoples.
A: Intellectually, no, because he cannot accept the American Constitution since it is based on Biblical principles and he believes the Bible to be corrupt.
Reality: The Constitution of the United States of America is based on universal values taught by all Abrahamic religions, including Christianity and Islam. All religions, at one time or another, have suffered distortions in the hands of their own followers. No religious tradition is immune from such corruptive influences of some in their midst. It is self-righteous to point fingers at others while forgetting the ugliest anti-Semitic images that have haunted Western societies in the last century in the heart of Europe and other regions of the world. The American constitution is as much Islamic, as it is Christian, and Muslim Americans are proud of our constitution and our democracy.
A: Philosophically, no, because Islam, Muhammad, and the Quran do not allow freedom of religion and _expression.
Reality: Nothing can be farther from the truth. In fact, the Qur’an declares in no uncertain terms: “There shall be no compulsion in religion” (Q. 2:256). Philosophically, the Qur’an laid down the foundation of “natural religion” (fitrat) with which God has created all human beings. It also made sure that complete freedom existed for all humans to choose their faith and spiritual destiny. The Prophet set examples for his community to handle the fact of diversity of faiths, requiring Muslims to recognize and respect God’s decision in the matter of allowing various faith communities to exist with each other and even with those who choose not to believe in God at all.
A: Democracy and Islam cannot co-exist. Every Muslim government is either dictatorial or autocratic.
Reality: The correct statement would read like this: Islam and democracy are compatible and can coexist because Islam organizes humanity on the basis of the rule of law and human dignity. But contemporary Muslim governments, in order to remain in power and exercise absolute control over the financial and other resources of their respective countries, have abandoned these teachings of democratic governance and accountability to law. These oppressive and tyrannical regimes are not Islamic, but usually driven by secular and even anti-Islamic ideologies.
A: Spiritually, no, because when we declare “one nation under God,” the Christian’s God is loving and kind, while Allah is NEVER referred to as our heavenly father, nor is he ever called love in the Quran’s 99 excellent names.
Reality: One of the most beautiful names of God is “the Compassionate, the Merciful”, which Muslims repeat at least 17 times a day. If Love cannot translate into “compassion or mercy,” then it is an abstraction without meaning or application. In the Qur’an God has prescribed mercy for Himself (Q. 6:54), and that means that in dealing with humanity God will always show consideration as it improves itself to establish justice on earth. Muslims believe that they live under the God of Abraham, Moses, Jesus and Muhammad. That God is Trustworthy, Merciful, Compassionate and Loving God who cares for all human beings more than their own mother. Islam does not encourage turning God into a political statement since humans cannot possess God. They can simply relate themselves to God by emulating God’s compassion and forgiveness.
A: Therefore after much study and deliberation….perhaps we should be very suspicious of ALL MUSLIMS in this country. They obviously cannot be both good Muslims and good Americans. Call it what you wish…it’s still the truth. If you find yourself intellectually in agreement with the above, perhaps you will share this with your friends. The more who understand this, the better it will be for our country.
Reality: No honest study about any faith on earth can lead to such distortions about the religious and cultural “other.” Muslims like any other peoples who inhabit the USA can love this country or any other country where they settle, without hating others.
Joseph… i think I read the same thing above… only different words… at least your one of the good guys, not trying to conjure hate for your neighbour.
Well done!!
Keep telling the truth about Islam.
Can you plesse tell though, why are some Americans like Sandra Searle really stupid?
Sandra read the scholars like Karen Armstrong or Tariq Ramadin.
You’re so wrong about everything
Then tell me WHY do muslims attack Americans? The US Of America has only tried to help everyone in the world to become democratic. provide soldiers to protect other countries, provide TAX money, feed them. etc., but then we are the bad guy. TELL ME WHY?
when has a Muslim attacked an American? Only Saudi Arabian’s and Christians have attacked Americans. 9/11 – Saudi… Oklahoma-Christian, Boston- Christians, Jim Jones – Christian, Uni-Bomber – Christian and The Anthrax Lady – Christian. So what is this about Muslim’s attacking America. You think Muslim, because in order to get Bin Laudan, you had to attack Afghanistan, which is Muslim. Oh,, a Canadian slap in the face to America…. You had us join you to attack Afghanistan and less than 6 months into the heat of the Battle, you pulled out and left Canada holding the bag. Bush had to attack Iraq to show he was better than his dad. Well, Canada fought your battle… now we are home with a major victory…how are you guys doing in Iraq?
I would also like to know why Muslims attack Americans. And frankly I would feel much better about the whole thing if they would come right out an say that; Yes they are on American soil and yes they would defend this country and it’s people . Just like the Italians and Polish and Germans that came to this country (all of our ancestors) the Muslims tend to stick together so that they can be around people of their own faith and beliefs… I understand and actually defend this way because it maintains culture and keeps our country rich… BUT in these communities is where the terrorists live and work and hide….someone somewhere in those communities KNOWS which neighbors, friends of friends, or family members are using their faith as a catalist for attack, but no one comes forward… why?If one is bound to defend the land and people where they reside then why the silence?
JP. there are presently over 50 million Muslims in the USA… that is 1/6 of your population… The reason you have not noticed is because all this bullshit is just that… you have far more problems with the Hispanics and they are only 1% of your population. Mohammed Ali, Cat Stevens and John Lennon not to mention several of your House Members and Judicial… Your not a nation formed from the Bible, in fact your forefathers said that no religion should be discriminated against. 1 in 10,000 Muslims could be considered Right wing radical…1 in 100 Americans are Right Wing Radicals… I am much more scared of Americans… after all Iraq, Granada, Nam did not attack you first. And don’t say Iraq was involved with 9/11,, if you say that then we know your still a Bush Baby and believe everything that lying piece of ….. said.. by the way,,, he is a war criminal,,, yep.. convicted at the world court…just like Hitler…
You’re so wrong about everything
ok,, show us your proof… and don’t wave a bible in my face… that is a book written by the Romans, not Christians….Paul was a Roman Soldier who killed Jesus’s Brother and Chased Mary Magnalin out of the Country so he could corrupt and change the Jesus Movement into the Roman Church with Roman holidays like xmas and easter…. if you really want to know about your Jesus… read Mark, or the Gospel of Mary or the Gospel of Thomas. Look them up.. they where banned from the Roman Bible even though it is believed it is the actual writings of Mary Magnalin and Thomas… not a 400 year later Roman propoganda creation
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I urge you to seek the truth, take the time to actually READ the quran and not base decisions on the words of people, because people err, Allah does not. If Allah wishes he may guide you on the right path, inshallah. There are those who not only disbelieve in the quran but go out of their way to make Islam look bad, the quran mentions these people and reveals their fate, do not be one of these people.
I have read it, it is copied from the Old Testament of the Bible, the medical writing of Galen of Pergamon and other Greek writers and a mish mash of Arabic Folklore. It was clearly written by a group of scholars who would be considered very ignorant by modern standards. Clearly it is written by men and not an all knowing God.
And you think Jehovah took a day off and came to earth and penned the Christian Bible? Maybe he wanted to get on Johnny Carson to plug his new book. Get real… All Gospels where written by men..
Further, the Christian Bible was written by Romans… well some… first the Jews wrote the 5 books of Moses in 650 BC. This is well known fact. Then in 70 ad a gospel called Mark surfaced. 360 years later, when the Roman Empire was crumbling under religious intolerance, The Emperor decided that the Jesus Movement could be used to control the people. 3 new books where penned….by Romans. They said that Jesus was not just a man and teacher like all the Gospels said but a GOD. When the Bible was put to gather, many gospels where kept out…243 infact… all saying that Jesus was a man. The also selected 6 gospels that where to be considered sacrilegious and burnt…if found in your possession, it was a death sentence… these where the gospels written by the actual disciples.
Fortunately, in 1945, they where re-discovered and have change the thinking of Christians right up to the Pope. For some reason, Southern American’s..not all of course.. but the bible thumper’s… seem to think that the bible is a word by word history… bogus.. even the Jews know better… it is so simple to debunk. Moses led 600,000 people from Egypt through the desert for 40 years…. well, Egypt kept very detailed records…no where do they say that 1/4 of their population got up and left… and the desert… A human can only last at the most 3 days in that desert. further, we have been looking for a sign for over 1000 years and can’t even find a dead body or old latrine… don’t you think a city of 600,000 people might leave something behind? The Bible is a story book to tell men to act better than most of you are… so is the Koran.. a story book, and by the way for all Christians…when Mohammed ascended into heaven , he was accompanied by three of your favourite people… they came to get him… they where Abraham, Moses and Jesus…read the Koran if you don’t believe.
I wouldn’t waste my time reading that CRAP! If I came across a quran, I would merely use it to wipe my a… It’s a bunch of s..t and I wish all the Muslims would just get the Hell out of America including Mr. Obama. I’m so tired of hearing about how caring Muslims are when all they do is cause violence and deaths of innocent Jews, Americans and Christians. After all, that is their reason for living and don’t let them fool you into believing otherwise.
Diana, your so stupid… so ignorant, so vial,, i can’t believe it.. oh yes I can, your American and know about as much of the rest of the world as you do about nuclear physics… bet you even think Eskimos live in igloos or People in Africa live in tribes and huts. By the way… I found a Roman Bible,,, you know the one where they try to tell you that Jesus was a god… I used it to poop scoop my dog…..
NO! Jesus Christ is the ONLY one who does NOT err. Your fake God tells you to do evil. JesusChrist ONLY tells you to to good, to love others and yourself. He is the ONE and ONLY TRUE GOD! If you want to read the truth, read the Holy Bible and REPENT your RVIL Muslim ways! Jesus Christ will forgive you and you will have only JOY in your life and live life everlasting! ! The quaran is not a true or good book. The Holy Bible IS!
you are an intolerant person Diana. Do you really believe that ALL Christians and Jewish people are innocent? Really? All of them? Even those who have abused children in the name of the priesthood? If you are such a good Christian why can’y you love thy neighbour as thyself? Or are you a selective Christian who bends and twists the passages in the bible to suit your own moral worldview? You sound as if you have hate in your heart not love. I feel sorry for you. You are nothing but a small minded bigot and if there ever is a judgement day you will be judged very harshly indeed for your intolerance.
I could not have put that better Travis… but I might have added a passage in her bible that she seems to have missed…. “Do not worship me, worship my father before me. oh oh Dianne.. you worship Jesus.. your sinning… he is only a messenger of the true God… it says that in your bible…read slower…. And the True God is the God of Abraham, who swore an allegiance to the ONE and ONLY God. Isn’t that funny that the God of the Koran and the Torah are Abraham’s God also. Jesus can only forgive you if you have forgiveness in your heart..has noting to do with reading the Roman Fairytail Book or repenting to a gay priest. Dianne, your the one that needs to find wisdom and forgiveness in your heart…
Oh Diana. **shakes head** It’s the “good Christians” such a yourself, who profess to follow Jesus’ teachings, that have encouraged me to investigate other religions as I’ve gotten older. If, indeed, Jesus “ONLY” tells you to be good and love others, what teachings are you following?! There seems to be a lot of hate in your writing….where’s the “JOY”? And, your language…..tsk, tsk, tsk! Seems like someone has some reading (the Bible) and repenting to do themselves. WWJD? Spread love and compassion. If Jesus means that much to you, study up and practice what HE preaches.
your funny.. read the Koran..says the same thing… love god..or satin will take you… and Jesus was not a god and your precious bible is two parts… the old and new testament… the old testament is in the Koran,, because Allah, God, Jehovah, etc is in there…then you have the Christian part… written 500 years after Jesus’s death by Roman’s… If you want to read the true bible.. it was condemned and burned by the Roman’s … it is known as the Gnostic Gospels and they where as far as we know, written or dictated by Jesus’s disciples… Thomas, James and Mary Magnalini.. and if you are reading your Jesus properly and saying what you are, you have violated your Jesus by not doing what he said and worshipping a false GOD…him… Thow shalt worship my father before me…..
the koran doesnt really promote equality. im pretty sure women are still not even alowed to drive in saudi arabia. there is no muslum country that is democratic. iraq and afganastan are at the moment cause americans are there. India? im pretty sure pakistan and india were the same country but the muslims wanted there own country. india is supposed to be a hindu state/ indian. islam can be used as a nice religion…but if u only use bits and peices of the koran and interpret it pretty loosly..(btw the egyptians were killing christians…for being christians the other month and ive heard lets kill the jews plenty of times not to open to other religions)
Jon,, the Muslims started Democracy way back.. it was the Roman Christians that attacked Muslim Cities to steal their knowledge and gold. Every science we have today that ends in a “oligy” and “omy” and “racy” are Muslim…. Astronomy, Biology, etc, etc… Does the Koran teach equality… a bit more than the Christian bible does… in it all men MUST follow God’s rules or burn in hell… in the Koran, men MAY follow God’s rules,, it is up to the individual they may choose satin too, but that is not the chosen path. As far as women’s rights.. that is political… it is a government who passes those laws… mostly based on misinterpreting the Koran as most you Christians misinterpret the Roman Bible to find reason’s to hate Muslim’s even though your Jesus said to embrace and learn from them and other. The East Marlborough Baptist Church is no better than the right wing Muslims we call ISIS.
check out http://www.thereligionofpeace.com and open your mind
from what ive seen this isnt the religion of peace. the grand mufti of saudi arabia declared all churches in arabia should be destroyed. how is that peaceful
Jon,, man your funny… so the Christian Religion is a religion of peace….lol… lets see Josiah smite the cities of and it lists 10… Smite means to kill every living thing,, babies too.. and burn the city to the ground… David fought with Goliath…hell the whole damn book is violent and about wars and killing people… your loving god smite two cities… Saddam and Gomorrah… if he was so all mighty,, don’t you think he could have change the people to be good… turn off Fox News and turn on CSPAN.
holly shit those people must hate to go to that extreme to publish their lies… scary to think that hatting another religion can be so organized… Can only be the Jews.. they are the only religion that has a material reason to get all of us to hate Muslims so they can genocide all the Palestinians…you know the people that lived there for 10,000 years before the Jews. Sorry.,I have read the Koran, the Torah, the Roman Bible and studied Buddhism and Hinduism… All religions teach the same.. love and tolerance for your fellow man… it is just right wing no-minds that badly interpret the complicated writings to mean to hate anyone you don’t like the looks of….. This is sooooo sad.
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